Replaced reverse band '99 Ranger RWD 3.0 4r44e
#1
Replaced reverse band '99 Ranger RWD 3.0 4r44e
Hi, all! I first time poster here, but i am no stranger the forums. i am not, however, an expert mechanic. My 99 3.0 Ranger RWD 4r44e auto (187k miles) started to have trouble a few weeks back when all of the sudden the reverse stopped working. All of the other gears were fine.. To make a long story short, i started with smaller things first, and gradually moving on to larger solutions. Started with a flush and refilled the fluid, Replaced solenoids, a blown valve body gasket (at the reverse servo piston), and each time i put it back together, it would fire right up, but eventually, it didn't move at all. Everything was pointing to the torque converter and the reverse band. So, i had to take the whole transmission out, and took it apart. I made sure to do my research before hand, and i did as much documentation as i could. I used a manual that i found on the forums here as well, that i followed as closely as possible. Everything inside looked good until i got to the reverse band, which one of its anchor points had broken off (i never found the broken off part).Replace the band, as well as the intermediate and overdrive bands, and proceed to put it back together, trying to mess with as little as possible, apart from replacing things that very obviously needed to be replaced. I get it reinstalled go to fire it up, and nothing. The electrical systems are all working, key turns fine, but the starter doesn't kick in or does the engine crank over. The shift lever is also not moving. I am very much reliant on my truck for work and i am on a very tight budget, so taking it to a shop is out of the question, unfortunately. I know that's a lot to unpack but any advice would be much appreciated
#2
#3
RF Veteran
iTrader: (1)
+1 ^^^
There is a THEFT light on the dash, it should come on with key on and then go OFF, if it flashes then No Crank will occur, called the PATS(passive anti-theft system)
THEFT light is under the oil pressure gauge if NO Tach, with Tach its under speedometer, to the right of Right Turn signal light
The DTR(digital transmission range) sensor is on the drivers side of transmission on the shift rod, it needs to be in Park or Neutral position or Starter motor will not work, prevents "starting in gear"
Under the steering column is the Shift InterLock solenoid, it prevents shifting out of Park unless brake pedal is depressed, so Locks the shifter in Park position
In a 1999 check fuses 9 and 13 in cab fuse panel
There is a THEFT light on the dash, it should come on with key on and then go OFF, if it flashes then No Crank will occur, called the PATS(passive anti-theft system)
THEFT light is under the oil pressure gauge if NO Tach, with Tach its under speedometer, to the right of Right Turn signal light
The DTR(digital transmission range) sensor is on the drivers side of transmission on the shift rod, it needs to be in Park or Neutral position or Starter motor will not work, prevents "starting in gear"
Under the steering column is the Shift InterLock solenoid, it prevents shifting out of Park unless brake pedal is depressed, so Locks the shifter in Park position
In a 1999 check fuses 9 and 13 in cab fuse panel
Last edited by RonD; 05-18-2021 at 12:00 PM.
#4
first of all, thank you for your replies. The theft light flashes, that was the most obvious. How to remedy the PATS? I knew about it needing to be in park or neutral. I just tried to shift it when i turned the key, and it will shift now somehow. Still no crank. My roommate and i tried to push it in neutral, and it didn't budge. Parking brake off, but now the cable is loose when no engaged. Fuses 9 and 13 appear to be in good shape, but i will change them out. the broken out part of the reverse band was no where to be found, even upon taking every component out. Ground up possibly? Any ways to test the shift interlock solenoid, or solenoids in general? I couldn't find one online that didn't require special equipment. Any more info would be much appreciated. I will provide updates.
#5
RF Veteran
iTrader: (1)
Turn key on
Let the THEFT light flash
After 45-60 seconds it will start to flash a 2 digit code number, 1 flash, pause, then 1 to 6 flashes, then longer pause, and repeat
PATS Codes
11 Transceiver [transponder coil] not connected, or there is no power to it.
12 Transceiver internal fault.
13 No Key/no PATS key has been used to turn the ignition switch.
14 Incomplete key code received.
15 Invalid key code received.
16 CAN communications error.
PATS disables starter motor, fuel pump AND fuel injectors there is no "bypass" for it, its a very good anti-theft system
Check fuses 19 and 25 in cab fuse box
PATS needs to be satisfied or engine can never be started
Key on
It reads the PATS key number thats in the ignition slot
Compares that to the 3 or 4 numbers in its memory(the keys it came with when new)
If a Match is found THEFT light will go off, and you can start engine
If no match then Flashing THEFT light and no start
AND.............PATS will go into THEFT MODE if 4 or more attempts are made to start engine after flashing THEFT light is seen
THEFT MODE takes 90minutes to clear, even if you unhook the battery, so you just need to let it sit for 90mintes key off before trying to start it again
It won't even "look" at the key in ignition until THEFT MODE has timed out, so heads up
The reason for this is no thief will wait around 90min to try again to steal this vehicle, lol
Do brake lights work?
If so interlock should also work
You can get your 1999 Owners manual here: https://www.ranger-forums.com/genera...1-models-3747/
Check page 107 for how to override interlock
Let the THEFT light flash
After 45-60 seconds it will start to flash a 2 digit code number, 1 flash, pause, then 1 to 6 flashes, then longer pause, and repeat
PATS Codes
11 Transceiver [transponder coil] not connected, or there is no power to it.
12 Transceiver internal fault.
13 No Key/no PATS key has been used to turn the ignition switch.
14 Incomplete key code received.
15 Invalid key code received.
16 CAN communications error.
PATS disables starter motor, fuel pump AND fuel injectors there is no "bypass" for it, its a very good anti-theft system
Check fuses 19 and 25 in cab fuse box
PATS needs to be satisfied or engine can never be started
Key on
It reads the PATS key number thats in the ignition slot
Compares that to the 3 or 4 numbers in its memory(the keys it came with when new)
If a Match is found THEFT light will go off, and you can start engine
If no match then Flashing THEFT light and no start
AND.............PATS will go into THEFT MODE if 4 or more attempts are made to start engine after flashing THEFT light is seen
THEFT MODE takes 90minutes to clear, even if you unhook the battery, so you just need to let it sit for 90mintes key off before trying to start it again
It won't even "look" at the key in ignition until THEFT MODE has timed out, so heads up
The reason for this is no thief will wait around 90min to try again to steal this vehicle, lol
Do brake lights work?
If so interlock should also work
You can get your 1999 Owners manual here: https://www.ranger-forums.com/genera...1-models-3747/
Check page 107 for how to override interlock
Last edited by RonD; 05-18-2021 at 01:53 PM.
#6
Thank you for the owner's manual link. Brake lights work, and PATS code is 16: CAN communications Error. Easy to remedy? Checked additional fuses 19 and 25 both have been replaced, as well as 9 and 13. Fuse 25 i was experiencing very slow power draw from. Possible connection? Brake lights work when brake pedal is depressed. Battery appears to be almost dead. Will provide updates once recharged
#7
RF Veteran
iTrader: (1)
PATS won't work if battery voltage is below 12.3volts
Acceptable key off battery voltage in ANY vehicle, is 12.3volt to 13.0volt
Under that and battery is "dead" as far as the electronics is concerned
And that would account for code 16
It means PATS can not "talk" with computer
A new battery is 12.8-13volts
3 year old battery is 12.5volts
5/6 year old battery 12.3v and time to shop for battery sales
12.2v or less is a "done" battery
Batteries can only last 5 to 6 years, some less, some a little more, newer ones are getting up to 7 years, but they still go bad
Get battery charged up or replace it, and I bet PATS issue goes away
Acceptable key off battery voltage in ANY vehicle, is 12.3volt to 13.0volt
Under that and battery is "dead" as far as the electronics is concerned
And that would account for code 16
It means PATS can not "talk" with computer
A new battery is 12.8-13volts
3 year old battery is 12.5volts
5/6 year old battery 12.3v and time to shop for battery sales
12.2v or less is a "done" battery
Batteries can only last 5 to 6 years, some less, some a little more, newer ones are getting up to 7 years, but they still go bad
Get battery charged up or replace it, and I bet PATS issue goes away
#8
OK, battery was recharged (and which is only a month or two old) and PATS is no longer an issue. But, we are back to original problem: No gears at all. Sounds normal, idle is way more smooth, I have no idea where to go from here. Any suggestions? My roommate was suggesting a new set of shift solenoids and transmission range sensor, perhaps ECU, but i am at a loss
#9
RF Veteran
iTrader: (1)
Test battery voltage engine running, should see 13.5v to 14.8volts if alternator is working
The computer and solenoids don't control "in gear" that is a mechanical function of the Shift Rod moving to R or D(2,1)
The DTR(transmission range) sensor just "tells" the computer what gear driver has selected, and also passes 12volts to starter relay if in P or N position, but nothing to do with "in gear"
There is a BIG mistake that can happen when bolting an automatic transmission to an engine
The torque converter has slots and splines that must be lined up with transmissions pump and input shaft
Not a Ford thing, and it is an automatic transmission thing
Torque converter needs to be placed inside bell housing and push in all the way
THEN..........you turn/spin the torque converter and it will slide in farther as it aligns with pump and input shaft tabs and splines inside the transmission
When its in all the way no part of the torque converter will stick out passed the bellhousing
When you mate the bellhousing to the engine it should go on flush, no gaps
And then torque converter will slide forward to bolt to flex plate
IF(big if)............you had to use bolts to "force" bellhousing and engine together then you have broken the pump inside the transmission
No pump = no "gears"
And also means pulling out trans again to replace the pump
Check trans dipstick fluid level engine OFF
Check it again engine ON
Level should be much lower with engine on if pump is working
The computer and solenoids don't control "in gear" that is a mechanical function of the Shift Rod moving to R or D(2,1)
The DTR(transmission range) sensor just "tells" the computer what gear driver has selected, and also passes 12volts to starter relay if in P or N position, but nothing to do with "in gear"
There is a BIG mistake that can happen when bolting an automatic transmission to an engine
The torque converter has slots and splines that must be lined up with transmissions pump and input shaft
Not a Ford thing, and it is an automatic transmission thing
Torque converter needs to be placed inside bell housing and push in all the way
THEN..........you turn/spin the torque converter and it will slide in farther as it aligns with pump and input shaft tabs and splines inside the transmission
When its in all the way no part of the torque converter will stick out passed the bellhousing
When you mate the bellhousing to the engine it should go on flush, no gaps
And then torque converter will slide forward to bolt to flex plate
IF(big if)............you had to use bolts to "force" bellhousing and engine together then you have broken the pump inside the transmission
No pump = no "gears"
And also means pulling out trans again to replace the pump
Check trans dipstick fluid level engine OFF
Check it again engine ON
Level should be much lower with engine on if pump is working
#10
Ok. No, I made sure not to force anything ( I have experience working on computers and you definitely should not force anything mechanical ). I installed by myself with jack and pully system I rigged under chasis and around the frame, and very slowly and meticulously lined up the bolts on the torque converter to the flywheel. I know felt torque converter click into place when I put it into the bell housing and kept checking that it was still in place as i went. I found a video online from 1A Auto that said that little piece that sticks out of the torque converter and into the flywheel in the center, should be a about a 1/2 back from being flush with the bell housing. Is that accurate? There are no gaps and the nuts that connect the TC to the flywheel are on without cross-thread and everything else married up very well. I feels like it clicks into gear, but doesn't lock into it and turn the wheels.
And and if solenoids need to be tested/replaced, would it be best to replace all?
Is there a possibility that its low fluid levels causing this?
And and if solenoids need to be tested/replaced, would it be best to replace all?
Is there a possibility that its low fluid levels causing this?
#11
RF Veteran
iTrader: (1)
As said, check ATF level engine OFF and then again with engine ON, need to see that drop in ATF level when engine is on to confirm pump is working, do this now
The Pump is what makes the transmission work, to move forward or backward, so yes no ATF/low ATF levels would cause issues with pump so no forward or backward
The CEL will come on if transmission electrics are not working, OD off light will also flash
Computer and solenoids all get 12volts with key on
The computer has a ground wire from each solenoid to activate it
With key on the computer should see 12volts on each solenoids ground wire, if not it will set a code and turn on the CEL indicating which solenoid is not showing 12volts
You can unplug and test the 16 pin connector to make sure it has 12volts on the correct pins, key ON
And you can use an OHM Meter on the transmission connector to make sure all the solenoids are hooked up and will work
Diagram below
Pins 1, 10 and 11 on the TRUCK side connector should have 12volts key on
On the transmission side test resistance(OHMS) for the EPC, TCC solenoids and then the 4 shift solenoids, A, B, C, and D
As said, none of these have anything to do do with "in gear", these are just used to shift gears once vehicle is moving
The Pump is what makes the transmission work, to move forward or backward, so yes no ATF/low ATF levels would cause issues with pump so no forward or backward
The CEL will come on if transmission electrics are not working, OD off light will also flash
Computer and solenoids all get 12volts with key on
The computer has a ground wire from each solenoid to activate it
With key on the computer should see 12volts on each solenoids ground wire, if not it will set a code and turn on the CEL indicating which solenoid is not showing 12volts
You can unplug and test the 16 pin connector to make sure it has 12volts on the correct pins, key ON
And you can use an OHM Meter on the transmission connector to make sure all the solenoids are hooked up and will work
Diagram below
Pins 1, 10 and 11 on the TRUCK side connector should have 12volts key on
On the transmission side test resistance(OHMS) for the EPC, TCC solenoids and then the 4 shift solenoids, A, B, C, and D
As said, none of these have anything to do do with "in gear", these are just used to shift gears once vehicle is moving
#12
I drained all of the fluid and put in new mercon v. It is at the correct level of fluid and the pump seems to be working, still no movement in the wheels. Check engine light is on. I'm not sure if i have access to the equipment to check the battery and alternator. It shouldn't be either because as mentioned the battery is new and i replaced the alternator around the same time which is also new.
Also, I just noticed that the drive shaft is not spinning. Is it supposed to be spinning all the time, or just in gear? It is RWB
Also, I just noticed that the drive shaft is not spinning. Is it supposed to be spinning all the time, or just in gear? It is RWB
Last edited by mopp138; 05-21-2021 at 02:38 PM.
#13
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#15
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#16
i thought i found the problem and it was the dentent spring being too tight and the place may have been a one notch off. I referred back to manual and corrected the placement. I tested it out an there is not the full range of movement in the shifter. It will click into every position except 1st
#17
Damn, i know you resolved the issue by now
Thank you for the owner's manual link. Brake lights work, and PATS code is 16: CAN communications Error. Easy to remedy? Checked additional fuses 19 and 25 both have been replaced, as well as 9 and 13. Fuse 25 i was experiencing very slow power draw from. Possible connection? Brake lights work when brake pedal is depressed. Battery appears to be almost dead. Will provide updates once recharged
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05-18-2021 06:56 AM